The MacNeil/Lehrer Report; Carter on Labor

ROBERT MacNEIL: Good evening. Jimmy Carter was out campaigning for President today as though he were ten points behind President Ford in the polls instead of ten points ahead. In one day Carter saw top labor leaders, Catholic Church leaders and` state Democratic Party leaders, all in Washington; then flew to New York to meet the Board of Rabbis and Italian- Americans. The Democratic candidate, a Southern Baptist, got something of a cold shoulder from the country`s Catholic hierarchy over his position on abortion. Carter spent an hour in Washington with the National Conference of Catholic Bishops; their president, Archbishop Joseph Bernadine, said afterwards that they were disappointed with the Governor because he would not support a Constitutional amendment banning abortion. Carter left the meeting without talking to reporters. But earlier the candidate got a rousing pledge of support and hard work from the leaders of the 109 labor unions affiliated with the A. F. of L.-C.I.O., and from its fickle president, George Meany. Four years ago Many spurned the Democratic ticket because he thought George McGovern a radical. Carter gave the labor leaders what his people claimed was a major speech on the economy. Tonight, an extended look at that speech for clues on Carter`s economic policies. But first, a look at the political emotions swirling in the breast of George Meany this election.

Videotape: GBORGE MEANY President, AFL-CIO

GEORGE MEANY: President Ford says he will run on his record. Well, one thing is for sure: we won`t let him run away from it. And the platform he is running on is the most extreme reactionary political document drafted by a supposedly reasonable segment of society that I can remember. It is a platform that only a William McKinley could love. Its tone toward workers, minorities, the elderly and the poor is paternalistic and condescending. It the Republican platform were ever enacted it would be the biggest giveaway in American history -- a giveaway to the corporations. For the elderly there are kind words; for the poor, charity from private institutions; for workers, more so-called "right-to-work" laws and the continued discrimination against sites picketing. They didn`t hail the good old days of sweatshops and soup kitchens; but that probably was just an oversight on their part. That platform is a cold, heartless document, conceived in inequity and hailed by Gerald Ford so that Ronald Reagan wouldn`t beat him for the nomination out in Kansas City.

Incidentally, that Kansas City thing was something. I was laid up at the time, but I kept watching it every night for the lack-of something better to do... and as I wept seeing these characters come to the platform, and these various Republicans -- Rocky and this big broad-based fellow Morton, and Reagan -- I said to myself, `who the hell represents the American people? Who represents the poor? Who represents the unemployed? Who represents the elderly and the sick? And the more I looked, the more I became convinced that those people -- the poor, the elderly, the unemployed -- were not represented at Kansas City.

We are convinced the American people want government that works; and Jimmy Carter is pledged to make government work for all of the American people. The American people want jobs; and Jimmy Carter is pledged to make jobs his number one concern. The American people want a government that is compassionate, concerned, competent; and Jimmy Carter has pledged himself to that kind of government. The American people want a leader in the White House they can be proud of -- a man of integrity, a man who keeps his word; and we feel Jimmy Carter is that man. The American people want a President who is responsible to the needs of the people -- responsible in his dealings with friend or foe, ready always to level with the people; Jimmy Carter is that man. And we are going to do everything we can as a trade union organization, as the representatives of millions and millions of workers, their wives and families -we`re going to do all we can to make him, and really the nation, the winner on November second.

JIM LEHRER: One of those in the audience out at the Shoreham Hotel this morning was Glenn Watts, President of the Communications Workers of America, one of the largest and most influential of the A.F. of L.-C.I.O. unions in the country. Mr. Watts was appointed today, in fact, by Meany to an A.F. of L.-C.I.O. oversight committee which is to spearhead labor`s help of the Carter-Nondale ticket. Mr. Watts, George Meany did absolutely nothing for the Democratic ticket four years ago. What`s caused the change?

GLENN WATTS: Well, first of all, I don`t think it`s accurate to say he did nothing for the Democratic ticket, because four years ago there were a lot of Congressmen and Senators running for re-election as well as the President of the United States.

LEHRER: The Presidential ticket.

WATTS: Okay. The point that I really wanted to make was that the .NFL-CIO was very active in that campaign but not at the Presidential level. Mr. Meany has made quite clear on a number of occasions that he felt it appropriate for the AF of L to stay neutral in 1972 because of the nominee of the Democratic party. Many of us disagreed with him. Incidentally, I would have to disagree with Mr. MacNeil; I wouldn`t call George Meany by any manner or means fickle. He`s a very consistent man and a very firm man, and I`ve found him very consistent all the sway through all of this.

LEHRER: Let me simplify the question. Is his support of the Carter - 1Iondale ticket, in what he said today, based on legitimate, sincere enthusiasm for Carter, or is it based on a strong negative feeling towards Ford and the Republicans?

WATTS: In my opinion, it`s a very positive thing, both to Carter and Mondale, although one could not possibly discount the fact that there is a negative attitude towards the President him self. But George Meany now has had an opportunity to meet with Mr. Carter on a number of occasions, he`s heard him speak, he`s read extensively what Carter has said all during the primaries; and I`ve been in close contact with Mr. Meany in recent weeks, especially since July 19, and I find him to be very much pro-Carter.

LEHRER: A very positive thing. Alright, let`s talk about the rank and file for a minute. Is the same enthusiasm for Carter present out there where the troops are?

WATTS: I think it`s growing even faster there than it did initially among the leaders of organized labor. 1 look back over the primary- and I`ve found that as delegates were being selected in the various primaries that they were being elected as members of organized labor as well; being elected delegates to the Democratic Convention in a proportion far greater for Carter than for any of the other candidates, right across the board all through the country.

LEHRER : But he was not labor`s number one choice, Mr. Watts. Henry Jackson and others were certainly ahead of him. But it`s not a case of the lesser of two evils -- do you think there is some enthusiasm growing for Carter individually?

WATTS: Absolutely. As I say, that enthusiasm for Carter as a leader was there already,-. As an example, in June of 1975 Governor Carter came to the Convention of the Communications Workers of America, which was held in San Diego, California. He was not only warmly, received, but he was accepted with a standing ovation of appreciation for the kinds of things that he had to say to our Convention in 1975.

LEHRER:. You make things sound very good for Carter as far as organized labor here is concerned. Does he have absolutely no problems as far as getting the labor vote?

WATTS: Of course not.

LEHRER : What is his major problem?

WATTS: And I think he recognizes this as well; there`s no question that to overcome a great deal that has been said by the administration and will be said by the administration is going to be very difficult. We`ve got to keep the record straight. And if anyone followed closely that which was said at the Republican Convention, you know hour difficult it is to really keep the record straight. I believe that Jimmy Carter, better than anybody else, knows that he`s got to keep on top of the ball in order to be sure that he keeps the record straight and that he gets the issues as he stands on them out to the American people.

LEHRER : And he keeps his support from labor that he has right now.

WATTS : No doubt about that.

LEHRER : Thank you, Mr. Watts .In his speech, Jimmy Carter talked mostly about the economy. It had been billed, as Robin said, as a major policy statement of the candidate`s views on economics; but primarily it was a pledge to the labor leaders to make things better:

Videotape: JIMMY CATER Presidential Candidate

JIMMY CATER: The basic ingredients that must go into a correction of our economic Woes: one is balanced and sustained growth; the second one is full employment; the third is stable prices; and the fourth is a Well-managed government that`s efficient, economical, purposeful, working toward balanced budgets in normal economic times. I believe that we must have a proper coordination between credit and budget policy. Now I don`t want to destroy the independence of the Federal Reserve System, but I would like to see the Congress give the President the authority to appoint the Chairman of the Federal Reserve Board so that the two terms in office of the President and that Chairman could be coterminous. I believe it would break down the disharmonies that presently exist, and that the Congress, the Federal Reserve Board, the President and the people work toward common policies. This is very important, and I believe also that it can be done. it would lead toward lower interest rates. It would let us plan ahead and eliminate the staggering from one crisis to another that gives us a roller- coaster economy that does nothing more than reward special interest groups and damage and punish the working people of our country.

Our teenagers start adult life believing that they are not worthy; that they have no purpose to serve. There is now an 18 percent unemployment rate among teenagers -- there`s a 34 percent unemployment rate among minority teenagers. So we`ve got to put our people back to work as a top priority and restore a concept of the work ethic. The work ethic is a simple concept. I believe in hard work; I`ve worked hard all my life, with my hands. I grew up on a farm during the depression years. We didn`t have electricity, we didn`t have running water. My father`s family have lived in Georgia for 200 years. Mine is the first generation that ever had a chance to finish high school. I believe that anyone. who`s able to work ought to work, and ought to have a chance to work.

A lot of people say that if you put people back to work that we are inevitably going to have high inflation. That`s obviously not the case. v7e`ve seen this demonstrated over and over; when Harry Truman went out of office with great pressures on the government at that time, the unemployment rate was less than three percent; the inflation rate was less than one percent; the budget was balanced; the interest rate on a home loan from FHA was four percent; and our people were working harmoniously together. And in spite of the fact that the President was strong and the Congress was strong there was a sharing of responsibility, and the American people trusted its government. Now we need strong government programs to implement employment, primarily in the private sector, but as a top priority. And if we carefully target government programs and government incentives we can reach an unemployment rate of four percent or less without having the strong inflationary pressures that have been anticipated and predicted by those who think the government can`t accomplish this worthwhile goal. We need an efficient government. We need to make investments where they pay the richest dividends, and that is in our people. Some people say it costs too much to put our people back to work; I think it costs too much not to put our people back to Work.

MacNEIL: Robert Nathan is president of a firm of consulting economists that bears his name in Washington. He`s been one of the country`s foremost economic thinkers since the early days of the New Deal. Mr. Nathan, you must have listened to a lot of economic speeches by Democratic candidates to that same group over the years; how does Carter`s compare as a call-to- arms on the economy?

ROBERT NATHAN: I think on the whole it compares very favorably. It`s very solid, there wasn`t some of the extreme rhetoric or the emotion attached to it that one often gets in these kinds of statements; but in terms of substance, in terms of solid presentation? I think it was excellent. It had a remarkably good content in terms of analyzing and interpreting the record of the country of the last eight years -- I agree with Governor Carter on the very serious economic mismanagement which has given us the worst unemployment and the worst inflation and the highest interest rates and the worst deficits and the biggest increase in national debt that we`ve had. I think he laid it on the line in a very tough, firm way, but more important, frankly, is that he came up with a positive program and a sense of hope which is what this country needs on the economic front desperately..

MacNEIL: Did you detect anything new in it in terms of his program?

NATHAN: Yes, I think the newest element, and the most important element, had to do with his articulation of the problem of reconciling a high level of employment with price stability. I think that what candidate Carter is very sensitive about is the tendency on the part-of the administration of Nixon and also of Ford to try to blame inflation on reckless spending and Democratic extremes, and what candidate Carter was doing here was to put himself on the line very vigorously against inflation. I think he probably has articulated an anti-inflation program beyond what he`s done before. But most important of all, he has taken head-on the policies of the Nikon and Ford administrations that full employment and price stability are incompatible, and what Carter has said is that unemployment and inflation can come together and that full employment -- high levels of employment, jobs -- can be associated with a price stability. And this, to me, is the most important thrust of this whole statement; and I think very critical.

MacNEIL: `Thank you, sir. We`re going to come back, but we`d to listen to a little more of the Carter speech as he zeroes in on one of the four basic points. He devoted most of the latter part of the speech to saying what he would do about inflation, and to chastising -the republicans for what he said they were not doing about it.

Videotape: JIMMY CARTER

CARTER : There`s going to be a lot of tough talk during the campaign about inflation from the republicans, but tough campaign talk cannot hide the fact that there`s been a 70 percent increase since 1968 in food costs... 70 percent. In health costs since 1968 there`s been a 60 percent increase. In the cost of a home there`s been a 70 percent increase. In mortgage interest rates, 30 percent. Our housing industry is now suffering in the depths of a depression; we have 17 percent unemployment or more among construction workers, and last month alone we had a nine percent drop in housing starts. And in multi-family units the drop was almost 35 percent -- in one month. We are now experiencing the worst inflation rate in more than 50 years: three times under Nixon and Ford what it was under Johnson and Kennedy. The 1968 dollar is just worth 60 cents; and I can see why the Republicans have had to turn to the two-dollar bill, which has not been very well received by the American people.

An achievable goal, as determined by many independent economic advisors and I`m sure agreed to by you, is that we can bring the inflation rate down below four percent in four years with tough, competent management and with the commitment to a broad range of measures designed to stop inflation. One is that as President, every person who works in the government, every agency in the government, every member of Congress that I can influence will be constantly aware of the devastating impact of rising costs. We must have increased productivity to put our factories back into production and our people, who are now dormant, into a position of production. We must have steady growth in our economy, at least double the two percent or less that has been maintained under Presidents Nixon and Ford.

The next is to remove or eliminate the bottlenecks in the supply of basic commodities -- basic materials -- as our factories begin again full production ... the maintenance of adequate strategic reserves so that we won`t be caught short, and won`t have to yield again to an attempt at blackmail or pressure on our country. `We must, when dealing with shortages, as a first priority expand supply and not try to restrict demand.

Another thing that we can do to control production is encourage sustained agricultural productivity, a great resource for us. Sire now export about 22 billion dollars` worth of agricultural pro ducts every year. This needs to be carefully managed, and predictable to meet our own needs and to sustain exports overseas. Tie need to enforce, for a change, the anti-trust laws in order to bring, about competitive prices -- this would hold down inflation. We need to make sure that the regulatory agencies have their sweetheart arrangement broken up with the industries being regulated. The original concept of a regulatory agency was to protect consumers, but lately that concept has been changed; and if you`ve studied the appointments that have been made under President Nixon and President Ford you`d see that almost half of the total appointments that go into the regulator agencies have come from the industries being regulated. That- would help a great deal to control inflation. The most important thing of all, I think, is to put our people back to work....

LEHRER: Gentlemen, Mr. Carter certainly makes it all sound rather simple and easy in terms of inflation -- doing away with inflation -- is it really going to be that easy?

WATTS : Well, while I`m not an economist, I`m comfortable in saying no, it`s not going to be all that easy, and he`s not suggesting that it`s going to be easy. Certainly, we`ve got to change our thinking about how to go about solving the problem, and that`s exactly where he`s leading us -- to change our thinking.

LEHRER: That`s an interesting thing. You made the comment a moment ago to Robin, Mr. Nathan, about changing our thinking, that he`s looking at it in a new way, etceteras; but that speech that Carter made today could have been made by George McGovern, Hubert Humphrey...it`s standard liberal Democratic dogma, is it not?

NATHAN: I don`t think it is. I really think that he has specific things on inflation. Look, why do we have inflation? We have had this economy sick for three and a half years -- less than normal growth, massive unemployment, idle capacity -- and yet, he`s right, the worst inflation we`ve had in peacetime in history except `73 and `74. The marketplace isn`t working effectively, and what Carter`s saying -- he`s talking about anti- trust, he`s talking about regulation...

LEHRER: But President Ford is talking about anti-trust and regulatory agencies, and there is nothing that I heard, at least, that hasn`t been said by somebody before.

NATHAN: I haven`t heard Ford say or do anything about antitrust; if anything, I would say the Anti-Trust Division of the Department of Justice and the Federal Trade Commission, which really try to function to make this economy better, have been riddled, in judgment, with a lack of support.

LEHRER :Let me ask Mr. Watts. Sitting out there, you and your colleagues, did you get this feeling that, boy, you had heard a really magnificent, new approach to solving the economic problems of this country and make you walk out of that hotel ballroom today determined that this man really knows what he`s doing, and this is a marvelous thing and everything`s going to be all right?

WATTS: Well, I didn`t come over here this afternoon on my white charger; on the other hand, I did hear a clear, loud call to a change in direction in terms of economic policy and monetary policy for this country, which, I am convinced, will go in the direction of solving our problems and which, I am convinced, will lead us to an unemployment rate that is at four percent or lower within =our ,,ears, and which can stabilize prices.

LEHRER : Is that realistic?

WATTS: Yes, I think that`s realistic.

LEHRER: You know, it was in the Humphrey-Hawkins bill, and they pretty well dumped that because they finally realized that it was not realistic.

NATHAN :No, they started with three percent...

LEHRER: He said less than four.

NATHAN: That`s right, I think that less than four in the total is entirely realistic in four years. In the second half of the `60`s we averaged three and a half, 3.6 percent. The question is, if you`re going to sit back and say, high levels of employment inevitably means inflation, then it`s not realistic. That`s one of the major differences. If you listen to President Ford, what does he say? "We must not recover rapidly, because if we recover rapidly we`re going to have inflation." And then he doesn`t do one iota of anything about inflation. Have you ever heard Ford even express one admonition to industry when it raises prices substantially? Never.

LEHRER: Gentlemen, thank you. Robin?

MacNEIL: Yes, thank you all. As the campaign develops we`ll be giving you other opportunities to hear some speeches in extended form like that, and analysis of them. Jim Lehrer and I will be back tomorrow night; I`m Robert MacNeil. Good night.