American Experience; Reconstruction: The Second Civil War; Interview with Russell Duncan, Historian, University of Copenhagen, part 2 of 5

that law has been worse but this early as a revolutionary moment for the united states and for people in general don't only three occasions in american history when we had the opportunity to really create quality live up to nepal into the declaration of independence and constitution the first moment we are as a nation was during the founding of the nation itself to break with britain that the constitution could have been anything like that point we slavery could have ended there was a great debate over

women couldn't they raise to equality and we could have broad american indians to to recall that in her and so we were forced to be eighty degrees to listen to this next moment that we have as a nation the civil war to open borders but to the possibilities of what might be and why he was the the principles the commission and that there haven't been completed two tours co understood that with the sapporo for linkage thomas' radical movement and more of a perfectionist in the bid for twenty years the eighteen poor yates falls convention perhaps to raise when he said that there was a moment when to raise all americans to equal this sport in this was to have a second american has to

quote them into voting rights his victory on her show rooms separate spheres so he's flawed in the sense that that is focused on african american manned primarily but he says he is absolutely extraordinary in his understanding that that this moment can not pass along without rachel and the dust and the poor horses their reconstruction does not carry the nation which homeless we have to wait until the nineteen sixties for the next moment and i'm still my mission just win with a soft represents hope the

soccer reasons promise to sell her present so a way to deal with the problems of the nation and let's face it in the north in the eighteen sixties and seventies african americans are not allowed to vote in ohio their qualifications the qualifications throughout the south in many ways provides a place where you can live african americans to political winds up to political equality once and then see what happens here and if we're right to ask him would think if we are men after all the apartments are questions of gender question and hierarchical question if your man will show people where we are helpless it explained it freed the slaves and leave them a while but he meant to make them then and he can push them

both right and they're right there and veterans than it is ok and that the threat of song four making sixty five refugees continue to arrive the suggestions and satellite home by the end of sixty five campbell has about two hundred and seventy five

people with possession of times in their hands that there is a steady influx of people returning home african americans who had grown up on the plantation jacob walker or thomas lawler settle on a return to a fine family is to unite themselves with the land in many ways people there with potholes to the land already there's little conflict the train will this plant it is that but there's also way and understanding that no now we're going to build our own communities to the people who were here as slaves struggling have equity in the land in the end an african americans coming in from other plantations have equity in is going to be on this land and so i was trying to do with the differences in people's hopes and

aspirations differences that was not happened during slavery must get out that we won it by now the roof we get sour so this conflict the circumstances on the other hand morehouse was moving people around with necessary to try to adjudicate the different claims that people can also be eight or nine months that campbell have owned the island in this experiment of separatism for strings a separate experiment for self sufficiency the

island seem to be processed for the friedman had clear new land they were out cutting trees and some temper to passing strangers that plied waters into billboards and the navy ships of european regions trees so ashamed of global marketplace with derek and it was very powerful player in the market so as people are selling tambourine and making new crops and land being educated learning the alphabet and end stage and in government in which they never had a chance to do the experiment brought more fuel to the plan applies more fuel to people and thought that that perhaps no no facts are supposed to be able to convince the us will work with those who were shooting were talking

about the time said what democracy is a basic slap in the face and wake up kaufman for work for most people who wanted to go to the nice to think that this was not possible to prove that it was possible to let the people themselves have proven that was possible they just needed somebody in a protector role which was counseling anyway as missionaries tamminen out of the island and and military personnel another boat tree supply of him with crimes and then

plows and food also brought in the new jobs also will grow atlantic monthly or harpers and then we can move is well aware of what's cool in washington after all he's an agent all follow the freedom through what it's his role to understand what's happening so that we can better law it is yes because

it is so it cost him himself has written the va relies information to make decisions that information comes from us ships arriving supplies onto the island from from military men who agree with the radical program and others it's a very tight organization

people trying to take over his additional performers attempting to to rome with him so yeah as far as the fears in the nation's capital but his campaign is well aware of what's going on their reads the paper stating whether it's for commercial weekly writing local next supply ship missionary my brain atlanta monthly through and always always the new york times is paramount understanding of national issues to his cameras will record he understands that there's a time window to crawl through and to push through

reforms that are necessary to make reconstruction more than a moment in time is trying to make it a lasting a part of the american nation and he understands that anymore there are many people who would like to overthrow any efforts to raise funds to equality he needs to live to fifty years almost but in a racist of north of boston and new york he saying the riots there you know just a great feeling of abolitionist and other young parents his warm self and so he understands that if he does not keep up with that dane changes in government policy that experiment failed so he keeps up with that all of this he can he rushes to on campuses true purpose to live to the free people on one central johnson the shows his true colours those as being a friend of white

supremacy and against low chu eventually for blacks in the country to scandal been does everything he can to delay that moment when the government and go back to work well i think in the end the military in georgia is operated by commanders who will or more insistent on pushing contract labor own african american it's and reestablishing the system is you re conciliation this to want to bring the south and to the nation well economically socially politically commission but economically and so on the best way

to show the south is again part of the nation and to oil me to national delorean expansion again is to make sure that this great staple crops that supplies and wealth to the country more flowing which rice cotton tobacco products and so as the freedom and shapiro is converted by andrew johnson who's in charge of employing the officers converted into a free labor organization that whose contracts will be quarantined along the thames can understands that he's fighting a losing battle i think in that sense so he steals himself two nurses to change tactics

of genesis in the spoon and so the calls of people don't sit still you know in the snow we'll have to do with on holding you to the way they don't want to quit the job they don't want to move to another opportunity that is if your reporters street in new orleans they don't allow any redress of grievances and if you stop working go to jail in fact temple's on the island became well me and refused to sign the labor contracts and pretty young for alaska's in savannah and two and the recently objects and come back to that point carol campbell is usually moved from malta says prevention reach

it his unit because he's resisting to our permission and under andrew johnson's first major reconstruction our national government is too weak conciliate white southerners first the us reconcile utilitarian issues have been pushed aside for the nation together all research the economic times allowed to land too so called ministers reports of systems but the truth of the matter is that in this recession was insisting that every time people to the land in ways that would never agree to do anything campbell understood that body and to make things worse

i only shoot because of his resistance to union forces re occupying you know because of his advice to wall street people not to sign the labor contracts the us military removed from his position and then also at that moment jewels schools to establish this is this young women education black children on the islands we will decide working when there's every concentration of houses the insured only on to put people back in more reason so many of the people who actually signed labor contracts

defiance of campbell's instructions not to know how to rock in a hard place in the sun and the rock was being military st simons says judy joo and as an end ms tims campbell's insistence that they would not sign that the president of the island and in picher reconstruction says they lost just want to do this right having been forced off the island campbell

assured mr allan kam was disappointed of course in the end the us through the experiment sen clinton so while we didn't lose hope he took the money that he had from his own experience in the north to purchase a plantation in mcintosh county he also gotten hired a flat boats and canoes into be free people who leave with those who agreed not to sign the labor contracts and forced off the autumn by the military families on the contract that they wanted to go with campbell he said he said i was wrong a purchase one thousand two hundred and fifty acres at a place called

also people climbed aboard the boats they went with him when they are i dont know it was much worse than the original rifle st catharines canada doctor chacon collect it means then we collected of words between them together put on the other leaves on top they have a separate kitchen rocks don't know he's on top and then everybody basically build homes like that now but don't know it establishes an association farmers association this is sixty six and the goethals farmers association that resembles in many ways a communal living that the four years trying to form ideas

having a general agent dividing up the land and because of the number of people gamble hair and the number of people who might come to dover later huge dams for informed together so in the marketplace so stupid you mentioned this on the campus of the southern about what that means but i think humans is the term

for can also experiment failed because of the incessant rains destroying the crops that he wasn't going to be able to meet requirements to hold the land for the next year and miraculously and there was an intervention in washington when radicals and congress to control reconstruction northerners that become tired of the backsliding of andrew johnson did become exhausted of violence law comes an end and other laws there isn't slavery they were furious that oil supply hundred and sixty thousand northern songs had a head count of this in the south and so congress passed the reconstruction acts in march of eight and sixty seven taking charge of reconstruction st george has not been reconstruct the reconstruction acts divide the south and military

districts military commanders it requires for their registration future voters black and white book twenty one years old and dress its importance of the states that requires the state to re write the constitution a setting with the young thirteenth fourteenth amendment the thirteenth amendment was of course already accepted in nineteen sixty five in making sixty five president johnson declared reconstruction and now i'm sixty seven comes to say no it's not because of positions mendes a voter registrar to register black and white voters and reconstruction acts you're registered eight hundred and seventy five a black voters himself in mcintosh county ny and some a few white voters is this one

and then and the constitutional convention to know this case under the reconstruction acts as established by congress the registration to make it three individuals to whites and one black man introduced russian and so the reflection won't move together to ensure fairness three people looking at the qualifications are trying to avoid any voting for

whites or blacks in this case in so scannell moved around with this when he was assigned to the second district in june tune which included three terms mackintosh will be a great advantage over the other registers in an advantage was that he often stood behind the pulpits of black churches since the registration something known from rome to skin tissue issue to see you to know more wanting to come and register to vote and under the new acts of congress were going to be about the road going to be protected and that we have a great black majority in this district to one white democrat in mcintosh county and we have

when you walk in jordan we are going to elect black churches we're going to elect a black sheriff's we're going to elect black senators in must come down to do more and be reborn again in the spirit of community and and if you come and register you can help and so so he'd guzzle room he's powerful in the trenches sees how lopsided churches which we could talk about his physicality mm hmm things well

the task there was impressive than the parents you is a six feet tall one hundred and sixty pounds for a black sheer eyeglasses they'd shoot us and three pieces of time period to the role of moments sometimes tropical insult to all the top hat all recess great presence when he walks into the room also for people watching television react to him on their dress whites or react if you for why this race is duhon says the attack against thomas campbell shows and the power of campbell especially campbell just stripes fly on an untouched by water dr racist has set or the you know working with the to what republicans as

part of the registration committee the way six nations erudite times he had great knowledge of the bible and the us government he was used to dealing with worker's underneath witnesses a manufacturing firm in your family your it's a heavy weight you why he was a preacher he represented black power the other thing that thomas campbell that's very important is that he was so complex should he was born free in the north and he was blind he was

you see an isolated plantation but the people tended to be for patients with a more whites on sexual transmission but so lonely island where most of the population have been on the hog isn't some skin color he was a black man doesn't call it doesn't address the potential to address that he dresses in ways and holds himself the same way that the current class has always classes in all the african

american church also in all the unease that it has been beech says this is part of a camel so christmas is the fact that he stands critically and he walks and low strong stripes he has a purpose to students has practiced as a preacher in the way that movement should

know a he is already decided the aching for teens he's instructing workers on how to robinson and labor on how to be treated a correction that it's important to two to have personal habits that the people of my dress correctly to keep clean clothes to stand a replica of people now to two guests may issue words and make sure that you're not offensive to them so so no reason there's a great confidence in which you represent himself and confidence is infectious and when people see this black

man theory confidently on speaking with anyone of any classes like their impresario he likes him understand that this is the working on the farm where there is often some descriptions of that hello discreet while i

guess that they're describing campbell and georgia newspapers vary according to the political stance of the rider on your editorial staff undemocratic papers and even republican papers who have less than gallup terrian reporter editors often described can go on into october ashley yates he's been described by many as the van wagner describes him as the king of the party and he's described as an ignoramus there's a law as a person who could see the desk in the legislature needs peanuts while legislative session is going on that's not to ask him this is racist but it does

reach into the depth so american racism and what people really and many of them see what's going on there at all the bases he dressed in services many of the your description a person and while the descriptions bishop ms bee has been

yes and during the voter registration process of course he's gotten a scandalous says is active in many different communities ten county is a community with a white majority in an active a ku klux klan but that accounting vote consistently for charlie gordon want to carry a vote consistently pointed democratic party candidates during reconstruction and what voters in the county when campbell went through a turtle planning to register votes he was poisoned letters from winston in one of millions who's staying in use it for days he he says that and other african american in the county was actually killed but was this all comes of course is eating seventy seven who saw

his experience in changing it he's young cannibals experiences as the richest your own major understand variations what slavery had been lightened sell the variations of race relations he was a costly different places costa whose usual physically but those provisions in children's most of the most people approach the

registration desk whites are seeing a black men registering to vote for rich in black student must have cause you say risk we and so to do with me you see get justice for african americans in the face i think i think it became clear to campbell but he was best qualified candidate for office he had ties with the military it ties with revenge tour of those thais remained even though they strain ties with the government it ties with the richest bostonians know to be wrong friedman's a

society's he was a known factor at the beginning of the republican party in georgia or use prominent speaking out for republican party barons the good ones the ones with a lincoln had is at least the quality and then in reconstruction so we also had a very disciplined following are already by this point the two to nineteen seventy five initially us and so i think that he came to him quickly what he might be able to do as a legislator to name is in patients

the opportunity presents itself he wants to rise and so is part of the american dream and cowardly he expects that individual should reach in and grab stores still yes with the registration of african americans and the reconstruction acts that was great whole idea that the moment had not asked for raising our blocks to quality with what's the american would would finally reach its promises so the reason

to movement now for representative democracy and if you have representative democracies in interior that is half black and half white you might expect after representatives are going to be proportionally to the population that's what i represent the democracy it's about so that the talent so blocking in oahu two lovely communities who had been leaders of the communities in slave times new blood to the area cancer coming in to to the community it's it's the moment in time to show what we can do this and then to show we can do as a race to show what we can do as an american individual and politicians seize on it has

been rip you do there's a gentle movement by black man to make clear why and make a difference in politics so that explains some have gone to the north and combat some have never been himself before appearing on the scene but generally for the community it's an opportunity and they see it clearly that that we were going to reach across class lines we're going to reach across yeah the lines of for a condition so the new memoir from a condition this life free and the us we are going to make a difference and we have a chance to government activists are supporting this the way they should have been some willingness and once we get in office it's our time

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